Joshua
Jun 26 2005, 12:46 AM
QUOTE(serverph @ Jun 25 2005, 02:03 PM) and if i may dare ask, what do you use to prove biblical information accurate? What do you use to prove it inaccurate?  However, scholars have long seen Biblical information proven right time and time again. People believed the Bible was lying about ancient Ninevah being so great a city... until they excavated it. Luke is considered one of the greatest historians in history because of his attention to detail and exact naming of places, times, and people. As Josh McDowell points out in his book "More Then A Carpenter," (great book for historical proofs, I highly recommend it) someone once tried finding a city Luke told of without seeing what he said of it and looked all over the area, unable to find it. Then using his description which included descriptions of terrain and an old well they found the exact location even though they'd been searching around the area unable to find it. In the Old Testament and what is probably the oldest book of the Bible, Job, which is believed to be written around the time of the patriarchs when Abraham lived, it gives multiple animal descriptions and speaks of rain as coming from clouds, elsewhere in the Old Testament it speaks of the "circle of the earth," if people had read the Bible they'd have realized the earth was round. Ultimately if you are unwilling to believe you will not be convinced, it takes a step of faith just like it does to believe in evolution, indeed more faith I believe for evolution and that "in the beginning, dirt" rather then "in the beginning, God."
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Joshua
Jun 26 2005, 12:50 AM
QUOTE(Milovoriel @ Jun 25 2005, 05:06 PM) one word .... Hurrah!
two words ..... Good Question!
you don't need religious dogma to set the moral template of your life .... morality is instinctive .... try thinking for yourself .... it's quite liberating .... XX As Ravi Zecharias likes to say, God doesn't expect us to commit intellectual suicide. Some people seem to think blind faith is involved for some reason, and while having faith without sight brings a blessing, not all, like Thomas, need believe that way. Examine this verse carefully to see what the Bible says about questioning what the Bible says: Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
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Dude Love Fan
Jun 26 2005, 01:39 AM
QUOTE(jzyehoshua @ Jun 25 2005, 08:46 PM) Ultimately if you are unwilling to believe you will not be convinced, it takes a step of faith just like it does to believe in evolution, indeed more faith I believe for evolution and that "in the beginning, dirt" rather then "in the beginning, God." I just want to ask, did you get that in the begnning quote from Kent Hovind? I heard him use it so I assume he is the originator, though I could be wrong. And in my opnion Religion(Christianity in this case) does NOT need to change. People speak of not having women priests, but what about women preachers? There are lots of them, Joyce Meyers, Marylin Hickey, Paula White, etc... While I do not actively follow their ministries I do know they exist. The way I see it Christianity CAN'T change, it is founded on the words of a man who died 2000 years ago, although I believe he still speaks through people today, his words will never contradict themselves, and as such you can take the bible to the bank. I realize people disagree with Christianity and that is fine, though I hope one day they change their minds. One book I highly reccomend to any Skeptic is Mere Christianity by CS Lewis. Religion is one topic I love to talk about and dislike to talk about at the same time. Reason? When you find like minded believers it's great to discuss things regarding God. When you don't usually you catch a lot of flak about being a close minded bigot among other things. Therefore I ususally don't bring up the topic unless I know who I am talking to is a christian or the topic is brought up by someone else Saves a lot of anger and hostility that way.
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Joshua
Jun 26 2005, 06:31 PM
Yeah, is from Hovind. I've liked what I've seen from him before, and he definitely does think about what he says. He wants to talk things out with you and use reason which is a good thing. C.S. Lewis does write some really good stuff on the subject, the other author I find really good is Josh McDowell, "More Then A Carpenter" is a short read that I've found excellent on questions about the Bible's authenticity. I do tend to talk to people who are willing to listen to reason but I'm getting better and better at just walking away from areas where people don't come with "all readiness of mind" as it says in Acts 17:11. As long as they're willing to listen and to think about something there's hope but if not... I don't think there's anyone who there's less hope for then someone who thinks they're right and refuses to listen to anything otherwise, and assassinates not just the ideas but the charachter of the people who they disagree with. Still, all things are possible for God.
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Dude Love Fan
Jun 26 2005, 07:40 PM
Completely true, and it's really cool to find someone who has heard of AND heard Kent talk, he is really interesting, especially his thoughts on Beer and alcohol. Someone asked him, did you try it? When he said no they said how do you know you dont like it if you haven't tried it and he responded with the question, "Would you like to put your head under the tire of an 18-wheeler?" when they said no he asked them "How do you know you won't like it if you haven't tried it?" Good answer if you ask me.
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adriantc
Jun 27 2005, 05:33 AM
It's not just about the women beeing priests, but about the hole concept of religion. I really think they are updating religion as we speake because if the catholic church would have tried to keep the exact same religion ideeas from the Dark Ages there wouldn't be a church today to go to. Why? Because evolution and his ability to adapt to new put men on the top of the food chain. let me give you just one example. The theory of evolution...As it seems Darwin was quite right and his theory contardicts (almoust) every known part of the creationist (hope this is the right spelling) theory. As you can see the catholic church has adapted and instead of trying to deny the obvious (Darwin's Theory of Evolution) it has adapted and sad that the evolution theory doesn't stop you from beliving in God and His creation since live must have a beginning. I hope yoyu understand what i am saying because this is a classic example of updating religion
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Anndi
Jun 27 2005, 04:54 PM
It would be interesting, to say the least, to see religions updated to suit today's societies. However, so many people who are devote to their religions believe that it's all about keeping things the way they were when religion began. Of course, many of us know that religion has changed since then, already, and many people simply fail to notice it. But there are so many stubborn people who might just kill you for altering their religion. Many people are just stuck in their ways and want nothing to do with the forward motion of society. But it would be good to have a very up-to-date religion, indeed. I just don't see that it would ever be feesable. You could end up starting some religious war.
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Milovoriel
Jun 27 2005, 08:34 PM
QUOTE(jzyehoshua @ Jun 26 2005, 12:50 AM) As Ravi Zecharias likes to say, God doesn't expect us to commit intellectual suicide. Some people seem to think blind faith is involved for some reason, and while having faith without sight brings a blessing, not all, like Thomas, need believe that way. Examine this verse carefully to see what the Bible says about questioning what the Bible says: Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
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Señor Maniac
Jun 27 2005, 09:20 PM
Religion is the Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe. So what if women are not allowed to be priests. What if the belief that they are worshoping does not allow women to be priests. I think that they are not letting the women do some things like be a preist is based on tradition. Also breaking tradition in their eyes can be bad in their religion. Also I think that you are mostly focusing on christrianty more than anything.
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WeLoveFord
Jun 27 2005, 09:26 PM
absolutely. for those people who've read ANGELS AND DEMONS (very very good book, you will be a smarter person after you read it) religion should be updated or else people will lose interest in it. Science and technology are taking over in this age, and if religion doesn't make allowances for science, such as accepting that evolution is more plausible than creation, then sooner or later there will be hardly any church-goers, because we strive for answers in life and science seems to be answeing them more plausibly than religion. that's just what i think.
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